asdfasdfasdParticipant21 December 2022 at 15:13Post count: 46
Hello, yesterday I performed the first tests with ets towards the devices.. I made a dimmer work correctly with the push-button panel.. the download is very slow..
I had connection problems with the baos 773 interface, having the dhcp active it doesn’t find the interface and setting up a tunneling it pings me but it doesn’t connect, to make it work I have to enable the NAT function.. so to solve the problem I started searching the web and came across a thread where they said:
A person with bad intentions can connect to the system to change the passwords to the devices.. at which point the device can be thrown away.. is this true or have I misunderstood?m00Participant21 December 2022 at 15:25Post count: 28
I can’t really help with the baos device as I never used it, but regarding the slow download:
What do you define as slow? Some devices can take 30-90 seconds for a full download because KNX is a slow (but resilient) bus.
Are you using the baos 773 as an IP interface for programming the bus? The device supports long frames which means its the fastest way of programming.
I don’t think you need NAT for a local communication from ETS to the integrated IP Interface of the baos 773. (If that’s what you’re trying to do) you should be able to connect via IP tunneling if you enter the IP.
Are you sure you entered the correct IP?
Edit: you can use a tool like advanced IP scanner to verify the IP you are trying to connect to is really the weinzierl 773. I don’t know if this device has KNX Secure, that could also be an issue (KNX IP secure could interfere with you trying to connect)
sinn3rParticipant22 December 2022 at 08:37Post count: 332
- This reply was modified 3 months ago by m00.
ETS6 manages connections to the bus per project, with ETS5 this was a ETS-wide setting.
In the top right of your opened project there is a dropdown (showing “automatic” by default) which shows the way ETS will connect to the bus.
There are usually 2 ways to do so:
a) directly to the lan interface (ETS should list this with the found IP address of the KNX lan interface and the port 3671
b) by multicasting to the network via your local lan interface of the computer (which shows something like 220.127.116.11)
The second way is usually the easiest way to connect, but because of your vitualized windows machine the virtual network settings may interfere with that. Be sure to have the network of the virtualization to connect to your local lan network and not block multicast or broadcast.
I never used the BAOS 773 (which is an IP router, not just an IP interface) but it looks like an interesting device, offering access to all group addresses by web service. When using Home Assistant, ioBroker, gira Homeserver, … you won’t need that though.
And yes, welcome to the slow world of KNX ;)
Full application updates (or the first programming) may take a while, up to 90 seconds are not a rare thing. Later you can send updates to the devices which is faster. Firmwareupdates over the KNX bus can be even slower, for example my weather station takes 7 or 8 minutes for an update!asdfasdfasdParticipant23 December 2022 at 07:02Post count: 46
Hi, thanks for the replies
@m00 ip is correct
Yes, in fact I think it’s a “parrales” problem too, these days I’ll trying to play a bit.. I was fine without windows but with this ets I’m forced.. :C
Yes, in addition to being slow, I find the programming system for hooking groups and devices very convoluted, probably because I’m an old-fashioned programmer.. I would have preferred a configuration file and I’m not a mess of device associations ..
I bougth buy the baos to have the possibility in the future to create some “routines” on a LAMP server but I didn’t know the home assistant yet and so I think it’s useless at the moment, but let’s see in the future who knows maybe I can think of something..
However for now I’m disappointed.. I took 5 “se multitouch pro”, they cost a fortune and the lcd that you attach to the arduino is better.. that sucks
another thing, for load management I took a hager te331 module, but how do I have to do the wiring of the wires? there are no screw terminals, what are they for cables with a single interlocking rigid copper wire?
Ok network problem solved, in fact it was just a parallels setting..
So is it true that if a hacker changes your password, the devices can be thrown away?
I’ll add another question so as not to create more posts..
I set the push-button panel to the dimmer actuator, everything is ok, when I press the button the light and a red LED come on, however I noticed that if I remove the power and put it back on the light goes on but the button LED stays off, so I thought about sending them the status value cyclically from the dimmer, but is that correct? How many seconds should I do this? Are there better solutions?
sinn3rParticipant23 December 2022 at 11:07Post count: 332
- This reply was modified 3 months ago by asdfasdfasd.
- This reply was modified 3 months ago by asdfasdfasd.
- This reply was modified 3 months ago by asdfasdfasd.
Multi-Touch Pro: Hmm, I never saw it in action but the screen resolution looks not very good. At least it seems to be fast responding.
As for the price, I don’t think it’s expensive compared to other devices of this type, but I think vendors need to pay alot of money to KNX.
Hacking KNX: When portforwarding port 3671 from the internet to your KNX IP router, your whole installation can be “hacked”, in fact they do not hack the devices but set random device passwords and you cannot program the devices anymore. And yes, there is no “reset” button on the devices. So do NOT forward port 3671. If you need to program your system from external, use VPN.
I have no clue about the hager te331, but the manual shows how to wire it and an electrician should understand the manual ;)
You can setup what a KNX device should do on powerup. Some devices (like switching actuator with bistable relais) can hold their state when power recycles, not sure about your dimmer. My MDT dimmers can also remember the last value, when KNX power returns they set the last known value and also send the status to the bus, so the switches know. It may be some parameter you are missing. I would not send status object to the bus permanently, only on change, or you may pollute and slow down your bus when many devices are connected.m00Participant23 December 2022 at 12:29Post count: 28
Yeah hager KNX devices are pretty shitty. You need to seither usw rigid copper wires or use a really small screw driver to open the clamp that holds the wires in place. I wouldn’t recommend Hager KNX devices to anyone. They are more expensive and have less functionality than I.e. MDT devices.
I have 10y of KNX experience and have never seen a case of KNX hacking. Potentially its possible either by forwarded ports or if you have devices outside your home (someone could remove a presence detector and reprogram devices potentially… Will never happen IRL)
Homeservers could also be hacked if you forward its ports to the internet.
If you only use VPN to connect to your otherwise closed network, I don’t see a way how someone hacks your system.
If someone IS inside yoye system and has a lot of spare time, they might set a BAU password, but AFAIK you could unload your devices even if a password is set.
Merten/SE Multi touch Pro are okay if you consider they also have a RoomTemperatureController (PI) integrated. Those are often times pretty expensive. The touch is a bit slow some times but you can load your custom symbols which is pretty cool IMO.
I wouldn’t recommend cyclically sending the status, because how often does the power supply go down? If you must, use a really high delay, half an hour or so. It might not be an issue at the start but KNX can support 50 telegrams per second max. If you have useless telegrams convoluting the traffic that can lead in larger installations to problems.
Regarding a LAMP (php?) or home assistant server.. I would highly recommend a more standardized solution, as in example the gira homeserver. (Either as a standalone version (futro 700/720/900/920) or as the virtualized version (hyper-v or VMware) as you can use many premade solutions by others or you can write own logic blocks in a simple py script. Its also much less volatile than some custom made solution which relies on communication between multiple protocols.asdfasdfasdParticipant23 December 2022 at 13:01Post count: 46
Thanks again for the replies..
as far as the dimmer actuator is concerned, I solved it.. it has a change of state, I simply associated it with the button led (unfortunately it’s all new for me :D)
Yes, I’m not an electrician :/
I have not found a load detection device with a three-phase probe apart from the hager..
it will never happen that I have to remotely program the system it was just a consideration..
Yes, I would like to do automations using baos and php..
now i’m struggling a bit with the double white mdt controller :D i have to play a bit ..
thank yousinn3rParticipant23 December 2022 at 13:01Post count: 332
There were quite some KNX hacks in the last 2 years as searchengines like shodan easily show you forwarded KNX networks. And I think there are no ways to remove the passwords on many devices, they need to be sent in to the manufacturer to be reset or you need to hack the eprom/flash yourself anyhow.
Gira Homeserver is fine to visualize your installation and have your logics running, but to integrate with other smarthome standard it’s quite inferior to most other (even open source) solutions. I use ioBroker myself, I know of alot of guys running openHAB or FHEM for that. Not sure about Home-Assistant though, I tried it a few minutes and did find several devices missing that I am running here. So it’s not an alternative to ioBroker for me. But at least is has a very moden GUI, which is where ioBroker sucks! But nothing can trump Gira Homeserver (experte) ugly GUI wise ;)asdfasdfasdParticipant23 December 2022 at 13:19Post count: 46
:D before i get to the super visor i have a lot of work at home to doasdfasdfasdParticipant24 December 2022 at 15:48Post count: 46
Hi.. I have mdt modules to control the led strips, and it has a date and time object, so I have a question, how do I manage the times in knx? I think through the supervisor send the time, but without should I do I have to have an add-on?m00Participant24 December 2022 at 16:07Post count: 28
I don’t know what you mean with supervisor but usually time is sent onto the bus through a server (Gira X1, Gira Homeserver, PeaKNX or some other visualization or logic server) or a weather station with GPS or a RTC Clock (theben I.e.).
You can send it temporarily manually onto the bus, the devices should keep the time somewhat consistent if they aren’t too old.asdfasdfasdParticipant24 December 2022 at 17:11Post count: 46
ok thanks.. yes as supervisor I mean home server, I wanted to start with home assistant..
But is it possible from ETS to send values, simulating in practice?ur63Participant25 December 2022 at 08:52Post count: 62
Also many KNX IP-Interfaces do provide a timeserver functionality, eg. MDT SCN-IP…ur63Participant25 December 2022 at 08:53Post count: 62
Yes, ETS provides functionality to send/set values.sinn3rParticipant25 December 2022 at 08:56Post count: 332
Some IP routers/interfaces also can send date/time from an NTP server to the bus, but yours cannot do this, as it’s primarily not an IP router but an object server that doubles as an IP router. And afaik the software of this device doesn’t offer much beyond that.
In ETS open a diagnostics window and select the group monitor. There you can send values to your group addresses to simulate time.
Home Assistant may also be able to send date/time to the bus, but I think you need to create some logic to do so, as HA is not a real KNX supervisor (as you call it), but some multifunctinal software that can also connect to KNX.
Homeserver is a real KNX supervisor, as it’s made just for this. It can send date/time to the bus by default.
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